** SS Marine Aquarium 2.0 NEW FISH COMMENTS ** - Page 3

ROBERT CRONSHAW · 03-31-2003, 04:32 PM

I seem to be all negative so i should point out i think the Redfin,Imperator,and RockBeauty are all excellent.

cjmaddy · 03-31-2003, 05:30 PM

They might get it tomorrow Paul!

Jav400 · 03-31-2003, 07:46 PM

Well the Blue Ring is one of my favorites at this point. Not THE favorite, but in the top 5 anyway. I ran a salt tank for years and years, and I always liked the colorful fish best, to me that was the point of running a salt tank. The Anthias, while a bright fish, is just to uniform in coloring for me.

PaulsPics · 04-01-2003, 09:20 AM

Well Aussie time has just turned the 24 hours to the 2nd April !

My Square Spot has returned , in fact I have just selected the whole tank full . I must disagree with some of you, I think the little fella looks bright and attractive, try a couple of small Blue Damsel fish to give them a contrast.

Anyway I think that ALL the fish look stunning and the beut aspect of this great program is that you are the person in control.
Fill the tank with your personal favorites, mix, match , coordinate to your taste. " Stone the crows " have a different combination every day .. have you tried 7 Lion fish at one time ?? Awesome !

I Think that every fish has its merits and deserves praise .

As far as the Percula Clown fish goes I remember in the tank that I had many years ago that this fish seemed to swim all over and did not ' nestle ' in the Anenome, it was a different Clown fish that did that , but can not confirm as my handbook on fish is not to immediate hand. regards from "downunder "

dhigbee · 04-01-2003, 01:24 PM

I'm happy to see the new fish, but somehow they don't seem as "real" to me. They are wonderfully done, but move more like automatons than like living creatures, i.e. too smooth and stiff, with no variations. They seem more like "videogame" fish than the original ones.

I hate to sound discouraging: I'd love to have more artists involved in MA. Jim can't do it all, and still have a life!

Mountainmaster · 04-01-2003, 01:53 PM

dhigbee, unless I am mistaken the new fishes still use the same movement algorithms as the old ones (except for the Lionfish).
I think the difference is in the textures, they seem too smooth. Realism often lies in imperfections and irregularities.

cjmaddy · 04-01-2003, 02:18 PM

I agree, - with you both! - The older ones do seem more 'real' !

ROBERT CRONSHAW · 04-01-2003, 03:19 PM

So let's all just put our own favourites in our tanks and be happy with what we've got.Let's be honest here this saver is amazing,and no water testing and even better no green algae.What do we want?

dhigbee · 04-01-2003, 04:24 PM

What do we want? H'mmm...

Moving 3-D background, individual fish behaviors, and inverts, that's all!

ROBERT CRONSHAW · 04-01-2003, 04:28 PM

Come on now it took him 6 days to build Rome,give him a chance.

ROBinLA · 04-03-2003, 12:10 AM

I think the new fish are fine artistically, no problems with them in that regard. However, I was hoping to have some movement in the bottom stabilizer fins of the fish instead of just having them stiff like they are. I guess I'll have to wait till the fish are redone with more movement. I hate to bring up a comparison...but, what the heck, I'll do it anyway. Although I don't like the "look" of the Aquareal fish as much as Jim's, they do have all the fins, including the bottom stabilizers free flowing and not stiff.
ROB

kona001 · 04-03-2003, 12:42 AM

I happen to like the Emperor and the Squarespot the best of the new fish. I think I like the Emperor because it is very large and stands out. The Squarespot is just so cute (comments my girlfriend used to describe it when I asked her to pick out her favorite). I think other artists (as said in earlier threads and posts) should always go through asking Jim to approve their work before putting them into his aquarium. And I do want to point out that this and the creation of these models is a work of art, and should be hung in a museum on plasma tv's (each and every version ofcourse.) I would like to be able to take my kids to a museum 30 years from now and see in the artistic graphics section of that museum a very large hallway with at least 30 different version of the aquarium, 1 for each year. That would be great now wouldn't it. =)

And perhaps in honor of Jim, a lifesize wax replica standing next to a computer with the screensaver running, and a wax cat sitting on top of the monitor scratching at it being fooled by how real it looks.

patscarr · 04-03-2003, 02:41 AM

And of course, Jim's movies will be playing on several of those plasma screens too.

Digital Lungfish · 04-07-2003, 12:13 AM

Reichart,

My compliments to you, Ken, and the rest of Prolific for all your hard work, it definately shows! I love all the new fish, they're absolutely stunning and I look forward to more fish done by Ken.

However (ugh, this is the part I hesitate to mention), there is something that I'd like to request/suggest/point out. I've noticed that one of the new fish models has a problem, more specifically, the Imperator. It's forehead has sharp angles that detract noticably from it's "natural" appearance. While I'm watching the MA and the Imperator swims horizontally across screen, it's not too much of a problem, but as it turns it becomes very noticable. Anyway, here's what I'm talking about -

feldon34 · 04-07-2003, 09:52 AM

DL,

I've never seen the 2 vertices that make up the Imperator Angel's forehead so pronounced before. But you are running a GF2 with 41.09 drivers, so it can't be a video card/driver issue. hmmm

I do know that Ken's fish used a very equal distribution of texture vs. geometry, whereas Jim's fish textures are wrapped quite differently depeding on the "needs" of the fish.

The easy solution is to alpha channel those 2 "points" so they are softened. But when the fish turns towards the camera, you might get a small hole.

The hard solution is to reshape the fish, then remap the texture.

PaulsPics · 04-07-2003, 10:26 AM

For my 2 penny's worth .
Just filled the tank with all seven of these fish. and watched intently with my reading specs on. Now it has been mentioned yes, there is at odd moments a bit of a ridge on that forehead, but as stated above , one has to be stareing at the fish .
I do not see a problem really , Serene Screen is for relaxed , sit back , take 5 from work . In that contex one will not notice that momentary difference . I thought my screen was dirty or had a fingermark on it !!
ps My video card is G-f 3 and CPU 1 Gig Ram at 300 odd
I am happy

Digital Lungfish · 04-07-2003, 05:10 PM

I've never seen the 2 vertices that make up the Imperator Angel's forehead so pronounced before.

Well, truth be it told, the screenshot you see above isn't from my system (although it's identical to what I see on my PC and my wife's), I just got lazy and copied the one you posted here SereneScreen News

watched intently with my reading specs on. Now it has been mentioned yes, there is at odd moments a bit of a ridge on that forehead

Key words here are "reading specs", if he can see it and he wears glasses, then I know I'm not blind!

I do not see a problem really , Serene Screen is for relaxed , sit back , take 5 from work . In that contex one will not notice that momentary difference

You'll have to forgive me, PaulsPics. I used to work in the software development industry, so old habits die hard. I'm always looking for defects and problems in new software, especially software that's still in development (beta). I'm not trying to pick apart the product or complain, if anything I'm only trying to point out things that I feel could be improved. "If" the developers agree with what I point out, then I'm sure they'll make the changes, if not, then no biggie.

That's also a byproduct of this forum. Even though Morgan designed it to be a fan site, it sort of took on a life all it's own and now the forum members also happen to be beta testers for the developers. So expect to see others besides myself comment on what they see in the MA.

Reichart · 04-07-2003, 08:42 PM

Thanks Lung. We plan to do a bunch of small clean up, including FINALLY fixing the BG of those little artifacts liek the 2 pixels of blue, and the caustic edges bleeding.

PaulsPics · 04-08-2003, 09:49 AM

regarding Steve's notes above .

I stand corrected , not realising you were a systems programmer and that everything had to be 110 % perfect for the product.
Wish that went for eveything else in this modern world .

My comment was put in from my point of view, a satisfied customer and I considered that you were nit picking or your own system must have been incorrect.

I did not realise that this forum was for the computer analysts only but also customers feedback. Based on that I will desist from further stupid comments and await the perfect product, as an enthusiastic fan of Jims original program .

Tiny Turtle · 04-08-2003, 10:04 AM

Cheer up Paul! You stated your opinion and then DL stated his and even asked for your to forgive him for not agreeing with you. Nobody said anything about anybody's comments being stupid.

/Tiny Truce

View Poll Results: What do you think of the new fish? (MULTIPLE CHOICE!!!)
<img src="images/smilies/thumb.gif" align="middle"> Blue Ring Angelfish	43	40.19%
<img src="images/smilies/thumb.gif" align="middle"> Imperator Angelfish	51	47.66%
<img src="images/smilies/thumb.gif" align="middle"> Redfin Butterflyfish	51	47.66%
<img src="images/smilies/thumb.gif" align="middle"> Rock Beauty Angelfish	38	35.51%
<img src="images/smilies/thumb.gif" align="middle"> Squarespot Anthias	43	40.19%
<img src="images/space.gif" width=4 height=1 align="middle"><img src="images/smilies/biggrin.gif" align="middle"><img src="images/space.gif" width=4 height=1 align="middle"> I can't wait for other artists to do more fish and/or special creatures!	52	48.60%
<img src="images/space.gif" width=2 height=1 align="middle"><img src="images/smilies/artist.gif" align="middle"><img src="images/space.gif" width=1 height=1 align="middle"> I would like to see more fish by other artists.	26	24.30%
<img src="images/space.gif" width=4 height=1 align="middle"><img src="images/smilies/erm.gif" align="middle"><img src="images/space.gif" width=4 height=1 align="middle"> I would prefer if Jim did all new fish/creatures.	27	25.23%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 107. You may not vote on this poll

03-31-2003, 07:46 PM	#43
Jav400 Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Tennessee Posts: 9,725	Well the Blue Ring is one of my favorites at this point. Not THE favorite, but in the top 5 anyway. I ran a salt tank for years and years, and I always liked the colorful fish best, to me that was the point of running a salt tank. The Anthias, while a bright fish, is just to uniform in coloring for me. Michael Administrator of Inside:SereneScreen Aquarium Forum, Chatroom, Fan Site & *Gallery* DVD Collection

04-01-2003, 09:20 AM	#44
PaulsPics Registered Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 71	A day has passed 2nd April Well Aussie time has just turned the 24 hours to the 2nd April ! My Square Spot has returned , in fact I have just selected the whole tank full . I must disagree with some of you, I think the little fella looks bright and attractive, try a couple of small Blue Damsel fish to give them a contrast. Anyway I think that ALL the fish look stunning and the beut aspect of this great program is that you are the person in control. Fill the tank with your personal favorites, mix, match , coordinate to your taste. " Stone the crows " have a different combination every day .. have you tried 7 Lion fish at one time ?? Awesome ! I Think that every fish has its merits and deserves praise . As far as the Percula Clown fish goes I remember in the tank that I had many years ago that this fish seemed to swim all over and did not ' nestle ' in the Anenome, it was a different Clown fish that did that , but can not confirm as my handbook on fish is not to immediate hand. regards from "downunder " Paul

04-03-2003, 12:42 AM	#52
kona001 New Husband and new Aquarium Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 318	I happen to like the Emperor and the Squarespot the best of the new fish. I think I like the Emperor because it is very large and stands out. The Squarespot is just so cute (comments my girlfriend used to describe it when I asked her to pick out her favorite). I think other artists (as said in earlier threads and posts) should always go through asking Jim to approve their work before putting them into his aquarium. And I do want to point out that this and the creation of these models is a work of art, and should be hung in a museum on plasma tv's (each and every version ofcourse.) I would like to be able to take my kids to a museum 30 years from now and see in the artistic graphics section of that museum a very large hallway with at least 30 different version of the aquarium, 1 for each year. That would be great now wouldn't it. =) And perhaps in honor of Jim, a lifesize wax replica standing next to a computer with the screensaver running, and a wax cat sitting on top of the monitor scratching at it being fooled by how real it looks. "We will not tire, we will not falter, and we will not fail"-W2

04-03-2003, 02:41 AM	#53
patscarr Pet Shark Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Back in Buffalo Posts: 5,460	And of course, Jim's movies will be playing on several of those plasma screens too. Patrick

03-31-2003, 04:32 PM	#41
ROBERT CRONSHAW TheMissingLink Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: lytham st annes--uk Posts: 12	I seem to be all negative so i should point out i think the Redfin,Imperator,and RockBeauty are all excellent.

03-31-2003, 05:30 PM	#42
cjmaddy Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Lancashire, UK Posts: 7,854	They might get it tomorrow Paul!

04-01-2003, 01:24 PM	#45
dhigbee The Snorkeler Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 29	I'm happy to see the new fish, but somehow they don't seem as "real" to me. They are wonderfully done, but move more like automatons than like living creatures, i.e. too smooth and stiff, with no variations. They seem more like "videogame" fish than the original ones. I hate to sound discouraging: I'd love to have more artists involved in MA. Jim can't do it all, and still have a life!

04-01-2003, 01:53 PM	#46
Mountainmaster Liopleurodon Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: 3rd planet Posts: 314	dhigbee, unless I am mistaken the new fishes still use the same movement algorithms as the old ones (except for the Lionfish). I think the difference is in the textures, they seem too smooth. Realism often lies in imperfections and irregularities.

04-01-2003, 02:18 PM	#47
cjmaddy Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Lancashire, UK Posts: 7,854	I agree, - with you both! - The older ones do seem more 'real' !

04-01-2003, 03:19 PM	#48
ROBERT CRONSHAW TheMissingLink Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: lytham st annes--uk Posts: 12	So let's all just put our own favourites in our tanks and be happy with what we've got.Let's be honest here this saver is amazing,and no water testing and even better no green algae.What do we want?

04-01-2003, 04:24 PM	#49
dhigbee The Snorkeler Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 29	What do we want? H'mmm... Moving 3-D background, individual fish behaviors, and inverts, that's all!

04-01-2003, 04:28 PM	#50
ROBERT CRONSHAW TheMissingLink Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: lytham st annes--uk Posts: 12	Come on now it took him 6 days to build Rome,give him a chance.

04-03-2003, 12:10 AM	#51
ROBinLA Registered Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: New York City Posts: 101	I think the new fish are fine artistically, no problems with them in that regard. However, I was hoping to have some movement in the bottom stabilizer fins of the fish instead of just having them stiff like they are. I guess I'll have to wait till the fish are redone with more movement. I hate to bring up a comparison...but, what the heck, I'll do it anyway. Although I don't like the "look" of the Aquareal fish as much as Jim's, they do have all the fins, including the bottom stabilizers free flowing and not stiff. ROB

04-07-2003, 09:52 AM	#55
feldon34 Forum Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Rock Hill, SC Posts: 10,947	DL, I've never seen the 2 vertices that make up the Imperator Angel's forehead so pronounced before. But you are running a GF2 with 41.09 drivers, so it can't be a video card/driver issue. hmmm I do know that Ken's fish used a very equal distribution of texture vs. geometry, whereas Jim's fish textures are wrapped quite differently depeding on the "needs" of the fish. The easy solution is to alpha channel those 2 "points" so they are softened. But when the fish turns towards the camera, you might get a small hole. The hard solution is to reshape the fish, then remap the texture. "Journalism is printing what someone else does not want printed. Everything else is public relations." - George Orwell "If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal." - Emma Goldman

04-07-2003, 10:26 AM	#56
PaulsPics Registered Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 71	Imperator Angel's forehead For my 2 penny's worth . Just filled the tank with all seven of these fish. and watched intently with my reading specs on. Now it has been mentioned yes, there is at odd moments a bit of a ridge on that forehead, but as stated above , one has to be stareing at the fish . I do not see a problem really , Serene Screen is for relaxed , sit back , take 5 from work . In that contex one will not notice that momentary difference . I thought my screen was dirty or had a fingermark on it !! ps My video card is G-f 3 and CPU 1 Gig Ram at 300 odd I am happy Paul

04-07-2003, 05:10 PM	#57
Digital Lungfish Obey the toad! Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Diego, California Posts: 2,557	I've never seen the 2 vertices that make up the Imperator Angel's forehead so pronounced before. Well, truth be it told, the screenshot you see above isn't from my system (although it's identical to what I see on my PC and my wife's), I just got lazy and copied the one you posted here SereneScreen News watched intently with my reading specs on. Now it has been mentioned yes, there is at odd moments a bit of a ridge on that forehead Key words here are "reading specs", if he can see it and he wears glasses, then I know I'm not blind! I do not see a problem really , Serene Screen is for relaxed , sit back , take 5 from work . In that contex one will not notice that momentary difference You'll have to forgive me, PaulsPics. I used to work in the software development industry, so old habits die hard. I'm always looking for defects and problems in new software, especially software that's still in development (beta). I'm not trying to pick apart the product or complain, if anything I'm only trying to point out things that I feel could be improved. "If" the developers agree with what I point out, then I'm sure they'll make the changes, if not, then no biggie. That's also a byproduct of this forum. Even though Morgan designed it to be a fan site, it sort of took on a life all it's own and now the forum members also happen to be beta testers for the developers. So expect to see others besides myself comment on what they see in the MA. Steve www.tron-sector.com - www.badcartridge.com - www.classicgaming.com - www.dinofish.com Today is the tomorrow you were worried about yesterday... Last edited by Digital Lungfish; 04-08-2003 at 12:14 AM.

04-07-2003, 08:42 PM	#58
Reichart CTO Prolific Publishing Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Maui Posts: 423	Thanks Lung. We plan to do a bunch of small clean up, including FINALLY fixing the BG of those little artifacts liek the 2 pixels of blue, and the caustic edges bleeding. *Reichart...* , CTO, Prolific Publishing, Inc. Come visit us Prolific Publishing, Inc.

04-08-2003, 09:49 AM	#59
PaulsPics Registered Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 71	regarding Steve's notes above . I stand corrected , not realising you were a systems programmer and that everything had to be 110 % perfect for the product. Wish that went for eveything else in this modern world . My comment was put in from my point of view, a satisfied customer and I considered that you were nit picking or your own system must have been incorrect. I did not realise that this forum was for the computer analysts only but also customers feedback. Based on that I will desist from further stupid comments and await the perfect product, as an enthusiastic fan of Jims original program . Paul

04-08-2003, 10:04 AM	#60
Tiny Turtle is pleased Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Posts: 7,365	Cheer up Paul! You stated your opinion and then DL stated his and even asked for your to forgive him for not agreeing with you. Nobody said anything about anybody's comments being stupid. /Tiny Truce Thanks to Morgan, Tiny Snapshots is up and running again with "Tiny Järvafält" as the latest addition – Go have a look and tell me what you think. "We knew the world would not be the same. A few people laughed, a few people cried, most people were silent. I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad-Gita. Vishnu is trying to persuade the Prince that he should do his duty and to impress him takes on his multi-armed form and says, 'Now, I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds.' I suppose we all thought that, one way or another." /Robert Oppenheimer on witnessing the first thermonuclear detonation in history.