When the New Marine version will released ? - Page 12

feldon34 · 10-03-2005, 07:06 AM

Originally posted by Ad_Enuff:

Jim,

The above MAC desktop does look very cool indeed, this is what most of your fans want to do with your screensaver.

I love it when people make up 'facts' on the spot. Maybe 2% of users would like to do this if it were possible. If people want to run some sort of Aquarium product as their desktop, they're welcome to look at competing products like SimAquarium and AquaReal.

Originally posted by Ad_Enuff:

Anyone else think this is a cool way to display SMA?

If it could be enforced that icons must sit in some kind of tray and cannot appear just directly on top of the Aquarium, it might be bearable. I think it's much better to get a 2nd monitor and run the Aquarium on that while you work rather than cluttering things up.

Originally posted by Ad_Enuff:

I'd like to see a poll on this.....feldon?

Not sure what the benefit of a poll would be. Jim does not make decisions on consensus or what is popular.

feldon34 · 10-03-2005, 07:09 AM

Originally posted by johnblommers:

Jim, you can breath easier now

On the Mac we can put any screen saver under the desktop icons and windows using Backlight 2.0 and it works great with Marine Aquarium 2 and Goldfish Aquarium. No extra effort is required on your part! Just another fine example of Macintosh engineering ;-)

- John

That makes the Aquarium look so trashy! I can see why Jim is fighting this desktop craze. If there was some way to make the Mac version of the Aquarium incompatible with Backlight, I think he would implement it.

Why do you have your icons everywhere? That's really disorganized! Get some folders and put them in the dock!

Ad_Enuff · 10-03-2005, 07:15 AM

Originally posted by feldon29:

Why do you have your icons everywhere? That's really disorganized! Get some folders and put them in the dock!

This is my Windows XP desktop using ObjectDock.....personally if I had a ObjectDeskop version of SMA it would look extremely cool.

Tarkus · 10-03-2005, 09:30 AM

Ad_Enuff · 10-03-2005, 09:54 AM

Originally posted by Tarkus:

Thats "flogging a dead horse"........just pointing out the obvious just in case others thought it was something "a little different"!

Although you didnt still answer my question.....

Tarkus · 10-03-2005, 10:33 AM

Which question?

Would it be kind of cool to run SMA on my desktop? Yes, for a few minutes, and then I'd want all that processor power and memory back.

I own Stardock's Aquarium Desktop (it has nothing to do with Object Desktop, BTW), but have rarely used it. And it's very light on resources. Jim's aquarium would not be.

It really doesn't matter, though. You brought up "democracy" earlier. Neither this forum nor SMA is a democracy. The desktop version is not going to get made, no matter how much you want it. You'd be better off looking for something that can run screen savers on your desktop.

Jim Sachs · 10-03-2005, 10:47 AM

Wow - a lot of messages in this topic while I was driving back from Oregon.

Ad_Enuff's opinion is as legitimate as anyone else's, and is welcome here. I'll just make a few points to clear up my position:

1. I consider covering artwork with icons ugly, and won't be a party to it.
2. Virtually no one would be spurred to buy the Aquarium if it included this feature who wouldn't have bought it otherwise.
3. Even if including that feature would double sales, I wouldn't do it. Money is not my primary motivation, but the Aquarium has been doing extremely well for the past 5 years. Funding of new programs is not the problem, time is.
4. If anyone feels strongly that an Aquarium program which allows icons on top of it would do better than MA, they should drop everything and develop such a program. The market is wide open (except, of course, for all the other aquarium programs which already do this).

Ad_Enuff · 10-03-2005, 11:02 AM

Jim,

Don't get wrong, I don't wish the original SMA to get bogged down by something else otherwise we're back to the Freshwater Tank dilemma, I'm perhaps talking about the future, which is why I said "never say never.....".

You have allowed Microsoft in the past convert your SMA to Direct X 8, for sale with "XP Plus!", perhaps now maybe a good idea to consider going back to that and allowing them to create a NEW Windows VISTA version which allows ObjectDesktop type ability. Lets face it even if your screensaver doesnt allow it to do that, VISTA may include a Powertoy ability to do exactly what I have been discussing....then your scuppered however much you hate the idea!

I know you say that your not in it for personal gain/profit, but to have SMA on every NEW PC from 2007 onwards would be a very good publicity for you.

Again just my 2 cents!

Jav400 · 10-03-2005, 11:24 AM

Your information is wrong. Microsoft didn't "create" anything, except major headaches. Jim did all the work on that, and then got screwed and tons of headaches for his efforts. You have now been able to bring up 2 topics that both should be in the dumper as far as Jim is concerned; running on a desktop and Microsoft, all in the same thread and within a few posts. This hole just keeps getting deeper and deeper.

10-03-2005, 11:29 AM

>>Yawn!<< It's deja vu all over again.

Ad_Enuff · 10-03-2005, 11:30 AM

Originally posted by Jav400:

You have now been able to bring up 2 topics that both should be in the dumper as far as Jim is concerned; running on a desktop and Microsoft, all in the same thread and within a few posts. This hole just keeps getting deeper and deeper.

Jav,

Excuse me, no offence, but I think Jim can reply/answer for himself.

Jav400 · 10-03-2005, 11:37 AM

None taken.

I am sure he can, that is what this forum is for, and he has done so in several posts. I believe the answer was no.

Jim Sachs · 10-03-2005, 11:46 AM

A couple more misconceptions here. I have never allowed Microsoft to mess with my code, nor did they ever indicate that they would. They did not even test it on their machines, as they said they would. They did not convert it to DX8, I did.

Second, dealing with MS was my biggest mistake. The arrangement turned out to be nothing like I was led to believe. The few sales generated by the PlusPack demo were not worth the trouble of dealing with irate customers.

Ad_Enuff · 10-03-2005, 11:47 AM

Originally posted by Jav400:

I am sure he can, that is what this forum is for, and he has done so in several posts. I believe the answer was no.

Errrr...hellooooooo! Your answering again!

Besides, I'm still discussing......I wish people on here would stop butting in and allow Jim to continue to speak and outline what he has in mind and the possibilities of VISTA scuppering the Object Desktop problem/hatred thing.

Ad_Enuff · 10-03-2005, 11:50 AM

Originally posted by Jim Sachs:

A couple more misconceptions here. I have never allowed Microsoft to mess with my code, nor did they ever indicate that they would. They did not even test it on their machines, as they said they would. They did not convert it to DX8, I did.

Second, dealing with MS was my biggest mistake. The arrangement turned out to be nothing like I was led to believe. The few sales generated by the PlusPack demo were not worth the trouble of dealing with irate customers.

Jim,

Thanks, I wasnt aware of that, I was under teh impression that you had a problem converting it to DX8 and you "allowed" M$ to convert your SMA for publishing in PLUS!.

So what's your opinion of VISTA perhaps scuppering your hatred of a desktop screensaver? Does this bother you?

Jim Sachs · 10-03-2005, 11:52 AM

I don't know much about Vista, but if it contains a feature which allows any program to be used as a backdrop for icons, then there may be nothing I can do about it. On the other hand, if there's a way of preventing my program from being used this way, I'll look into it.

Ad_Enuff · 10-03-2005, 11:57 AM

Originally posted by Jim Sachs:

I don't know much about Vista, but if it contains a feature which allows any program to be used as a backdrop for icons, then there may be nothing I can do about it. On the other hand, if there's a way of preventing my program from being used this way, I'll look into it.

You'll need to research it, VISTA's all NEW GUI allows 3D graphics on the desktop as standard.

At the moment M$ is demonstrating 3D effects, transparency etc out the box....which will require a high spec PC and the necessity to have a powerful DX9/10 graphics card.

schneb · 10-03-2005, 12:00 PM

Originally posted by Jim Sachs:

Has anyone here ever seen a live example of this fish? I've found about a dozen pics, but the color of the body is so different from one pic to the next that I really can't differentiate the real color from lighting artifacts. Is this fish black, gray, blue, purple or brown?

Yes, I can be your point of reference regarding the Achilles Tang. I bought an underwater housing for my Sony TRV900 for my first trip to Maui and I had a blast snorkeling. Here is my best shot. The colors are pretty accurate.

http://www.schneblin.com/maui/08c.wmv

This is a very accurate photo of their color...
http://hanauma1.com/fish/surgeon/achilles_tang.jpg
To the naked eye, they look this dark...
http://www.nps.gov/npsa/NPSAfish/ima...hur/reef10.jpg

So something in between the two will work on the monitor. After seeing your example screenshot, it looks like you got it pretty close. I would make it a little darker--this makes the orange pop. They are very dark and rich in color.

As for your second fish... consider the following suggestions.
Orange Spine Unicorn (see movie file above)
Yellow Tail Surgeon Fish

Let me know if you need any other information, you can write me via my website at: http://www.schneblin.com/

Jim Sachs · 10-03-2005, 12:06 PM

Well done schneb! That movie is very informative, especially regarding behavior. Those Achilles Tangs are quite feisty. I plan to program in fish behvior in an upcoming version of the Aquarium.

johnblommers · 10-03-2005, 12:11 PM

Originally posted by feldon29:

That makes the Aquarium look so trashy! I can see why Jim is fighting this desktop craze. If there was some way to make the Mac version of the Aquarium incompatible with Backlight, I think he would implement it.

Why do you have your icons everywhere? That's really disorganized! Get some folders and put them in the dock!

Jim would not go out of his way to break Marine Aquarium just to defeat Backdrop 2. That is Microsoft tactic similar to "DOS ain't done 'til Lotus won't run" and isn't an ethical business tactic. I know you are pulling my chain Feldon

MA for the Macintosh is a fine piece of engineering. It works with Backlight 2, it has a separate application, and so you can take screen shots and use them as static wallpaper. MA also has unbelievable frame rates. All these features allows the end user to enjoy MA in creative new ways not initially imagined (except perhaps in Jim's worst nightmares ;-)

On the Mac there is a separate MA application in a window on a second monitor and I use it quite a bit. Sometimes when I'm in one of my crazy moods I run several copies at once! In fact I'm feeling a little crazy right now - see attached

Your point as to why do I clutter my desktop with so many icons is WELL TAKEN. My poor desktop IS a mess and i SHOULD use my wonderful Dock for such purpose.

This place sure has a lively following! Rock on everybody!

- John

10-03-2005, 07:06 AM	#221
feldon34 Forum Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Rock Hill, SC Posts: 10,938	Originally posted by Ad_Enuff: Jim, The above MAC desktop does look very cool indeed, this is what most of your fans want to do with your screensaver. I love it when people make up 'facts' on the spot. Maybe 2% of users would like to do this if it were possible. If people want to run some sort of Aquarium product as their desktop, they're welcome to look at competing products like SimAquarium and AquaReal. Originally posted by Ad_Enuff: Anyone else think this is a cool way to display SMA? If it could be enforced that icons must sit in some kind of tray and cannot appear just directly on top of the Aquarium, it might be bearable. I think it's much better to get a 2nd monitor and run the Aquarium on that while you work rather than cluttering things up. Originally posted by Ad_Enuff: I'd like to see a poll on this.....feldon? Not sure what the benefit of a poll would be. Jim does not make decisions on consensus or what is popular. "Journalism is printing what someone else does not want printed. Everything else is public relations." - George Orwell "If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal." - Emma Goldman

10-03-2005, 07:09 AM	#222
feldon34 Forum Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Rock Hill, SC Posts: 10,938	Originally posted by johnblommers: Jim, you can breath easier now On the Mac we can put any screen saver under the desktop icons and windows using Backlight 2.0 and it works great with Marine Aquarium 2 and Goldfish Aquarium. No extra effort is required on your part! Just another fine example of Macintosh engineering ;-) - John That makes the Aquarium look so trashy! I can see why Jim is fighting this desktop craze. If there was some way to make the Mac version of the Aquarium incompatible with Backlight, I think he would implement it. Why do you have your icons everywhere? That's really disorganized! Get some folders and put them in the dock! "Journalism is printing what someone else does not want printed. Everything else is public relations." - George Orwell "If voting changed anything, they'd make it illegal." - Emma Goldman

10-03-2005, 09:54 AM	#225
Ad_Enuff Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: London, UK Posts: 99	Originally posted by Tarkus: Thats "flogging a dead horse"........just pointing out the obvious just in case others thought it was something "a little different"! Although you didnt still answer my question..... AMD Ryzen 5 2600X, 3600.0 MHz, 16Gb DDR4 RAM, NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 Ti, 4Gb RAM, Windows 10 PRO 64Bit

10-03-2005, 10:47 AM	#227
Jim Sachs Developer Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Southern Oregon Posts: 9,774	Wow - a lot of messages in this topic while I was driving back from Oregon. Ad_Enuff's opinion is as legitimate as anyone else's, and is welcome here. I'll just make a few points to clear up my position: 1. I consider covering artwork with icons ugly, and won't be a party to it. 2. Virtually no one would be spurred to buy the Aquarium if it included this feature who wouldn't have bought it otherwise. 3. Even if including that feature would double sales, I wouldn't do it. Money is not my primary motivation, but the Aquarium has been doing extremely well for the past 5 years. Funding of new programs is not the problem, time is. 4. If anyone feels strongly that an Aquarium program which allows icons on top of it would do better than MA, they should drop everything and develop such a program. The market is wide open (except, of course, for all the other aquarium programs which already do this). Jim Sachs Creator of SereneScreen Aquarium

10-03-2005, 11:02 AM	#228
Ad_Enuff Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: London, UK Posts: 99	Jim, Don't get wrong, I don't wish the original SMA to get bogged down by something else otherwise we're back to the Freshwater Tank dilemma, I'm perhaps talking about the future, which is why I said "never say never.....". You have allowed Microsoft in the past convert your SMA to Direct X 8, for sale with "XP Plus!", perhaps now maybe a good idea to consider going back to that and allowing them to create a NEW Windows VISTA version which allows ObjectDesktop type ability. Lets face it even if your screensaver doesnt allow it to do that, VISTA may include a Powertoy ability to do exactly what I have been discussing....then your scuppered however much you hate the idea! I know you say that your not in it for personal gain/profit, but to have SMA on every NEW PC from 2007 onwards would be a very good publicity for you. Again just my 2 cents! AMD Ryzen 5 2600X, 3600.0 MHz, 16Gb DDR4 RAM, NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 Ti, 4Gb RAM, Windows 10 PRO 64Bit

10-03-2005, 09:30 AM	#224
Tarkus Shark Bytes Join Date: May 2005 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 158

10-03-2005, 10:33 AM	#226
Tarkus Shark Bytes Join Date: May 2005 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 158	Which question? Would it be kind of cool to run SMA on my desktop? Yes, for a few minutes, and then I'd want all that processor power and memory back. I own Stardock's Aquarium Desktop (it has nothing to do with Object Desktop, BTW), but have rarely used it. And it's very light on resources. Jim's aquarium would not be. It really doesn't matter, though. You brought up "democracy" earlier. Neither this forum nor SMA is a democracy. The desktop version is not going to get made, no matter how much you want it. You'd be better off looking for something that can run screen savers on your desktop.

10-03-2005, 11:24 AM	#229
Jav400 Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Tennessee Posts: 9,725	Your information is wrong. Microsoft didn't "create" anything, except major headaches. Jim did all the work on that, and then got screwed and tons of headaches for his efforts. You have now been able to bring up 2 topics that both should be in the dumper as far as Jim is concerned; running on a desktop and Microsoft, all in the same thread and within a few posts. This hole just keeps getting deeper and deeper. Michael Administrator of Inside:SereneScreen Aquarium Forum, Chatroom, Fan Site & *Gallery* DVD Collection

10-03-2005, 11:29 AM	#230
klyntun Guest Posts: n/a	>>Yawn!<< It's deja vu all over again.

10-03-2005, 11:30 AM	#231
Ad_Enuff Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: London, UK Posts: 99	Originally posted by Jav400: You have now been able to bring up 2 topics that both should be in the dumper as far as Jim is concerned; running on a desktop and Microsoft, all in the same thread and within a few posts. This hole just keeps getting deeper and deeper. Jav, Excuse me, no offence, but I think Jim can reply/answer for himself. AMD Ryzen 5 2600X, 3600.0 MHz, 16Gb DDR4 RAM, NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 Ti, 4Gb RAM, Windows 10 PRO 64Bit

10-03-2005, 11:37 AM	#232
Jav400 Administrator Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Tennessee Posts: 9,725	None taken. I am sure he can, that is what this forum is for, and he has done so in several posts. I believe the answer was no. Michael Administrator of Inside:SereneScreen Aquarium Forum, Chatroom, Fan Site & *Gallery* DVD Collection

10-03-2005, 11:46 AM	#233
Jim Sachs Developer Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Southern Oregon Posts: 9,774	A couple more misconceptions here. I have never allowed Microsoft to mess with my code, nor did they ever indicate that they would. They did not even test it on their machines, as they said they would. They did not convert it to DX8, I did. Second, dealing with MS was my biggest mistake. The arrangement turned out to be nothing like I was led to believe. The few sales generated by the PlusPack demo were not worth the trouble of dealing with irate customers. Jim Sachs Creator of SereneScreen Aquarium

10-03-2005, 11:47 AM	#234
Ad_Enuff Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: London, UK Posts: 99	Originally posted by Jav400: I am sure he can, that is what this forum is for, and he has done so in several posts. I believe the answer was no. Errrr...hellooooooo! Your answering again! Besides, I'm still discussing......I wish people on here would stop butting in and allow Jim to continue to speak and outline what he has in mind and the possibilities of VISTA scuppering the Object Desktop problem/hatred thing. AMD Ryzen 5 2600X, 3600.0 MHz, 16Gb DDR4 RAM, NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 Ti, 4Gb RAM, Windows 10 PRO 64Bit

10-03-2005, 11:50 AM	#235
Ad_Enuff Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: London, UK Posts: 99	Originally posted by Jim Sachs: A couple more misconceptions here. I have never allowed Microsoft to mess with my code, nor did they ever indicate that they would. They did not even test it on their machines, as they said they would. They did not convert it to DX8, I did. Second, dealing with MS was my biggest mistake. The arrangement turned out to be nothing like I was led to believe. The few sales generated by the PlusPack demo were not worth the trouble of dealing with irate customers. Jim, Thanks, I wasnt aware of that, I was under teh impression that you had a problem converting it to DX8 and you "allowed" M$ to convert your SMA for publishing in PLUS!. So what's your opinion of VISTA perhaps scuppering your hatred of a desktop screensaver? Does this bother you? AMD Ryzen 5 2600X, 3600.0 MHz, 16Gb DDR4 RAM, NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 Ti, 4Gb RAM, Windows 10 PRO 64Bit

10-03-2005, 11:52 AM	#236
Jim Sachs Developer Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Southern Oregon Posts: 9,774	I don't know much about Vista, but if it contains a feature which allows any program to be used as a backdrop for icons, then there may be nothing I can do about it. On the other hand, if there's a way of preventing my program from being used this way, I'll look into it. Jim Sachs Creator of SereneScreen Aquarium

10-03-2005, 11:57 AM	#237
Ad_Enuff Registered Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: London, UK Posts: 99	Originally posted by Jim Sachs: I don't know much about Vista, but if it contains a feature which allows any program to be used as a backdrop for icons, then there may be nothing I can do about it. On the other hand, if there's a way of preventing my program from being used this way, I'll look into it. You'll need to research it, VISTA's all NEW GUI allows 3D graphics on the desktop as standard. At the moment M$ is demonstrating 3D effects, transparency etc out the box....which will require a high spec PC and the necessity to have a powerful DX9/10 graphics card. AMD Ryzen 5 2600X, 3600.0 MHz, 16Gb DDR4 RAM, NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050 Ti, 4Gb RAM, Windows 10 PRO 64Bit

10-03-2005, 12:00 PM	#238
schneb Registered Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Redlands, CA Posts: 51	Originally posted by Jim Sachs: Has anyone here ever seen a live example of this fish? I've found about a dozen pics, but the color of the body is so different from one pic to the next that I really can't differentiate the real color from lighting artifacts. Is this fish black, gray, blue, purple or brown? Yes, I can be your point of reference regarding the Achilles Tang. I bought an underwater housing for my Sony TRV900 for my first trip to Maui and I had a blast snorkeling. Here is my best shot. The colors are pretty accurate. http://www.schneblin.com/maui/08c.wmv This is a very accurate photo of their color... http://hanauma1.com/fish/surgeon/achilles_tang.jpg To the naked eye, they look this dark... http://www.nps.gov/npsa/NPSAfish/ima...hur/reef10.jpg So something in between the two will work on the monitor. After seeing your example screenshot, it looks like you got it pretty close. I would make it a little darker--this makes the orange pop. They are very dark and rich in color. As for your second fish... consider the following suggestions. Orange Spine Unicorn (see movie file above) Yellow Tail Surgeon Fish Let me know if you need any other information, you can write me via my website at: http://www.schneblin.com/

10-03-2005, 12:06 PM	#239
Jim Sachs Developer Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Southern Oregon Posts: 9,774	Well done schneb! That movie is very informative, especially regarding behavior. Those Achilles Tangs are quite feisty. I plan to program in fish behvior in an upcoming version of the Aquarium. Jim Sachs Creator of SereneScreen Aquarium