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Old 06-02-2009, 01:08 PM   #1
sca
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Question Vista x64 Crash Accessing the Settings Panel

Hi,

I am currently running MA3 Beta. I am running dual Opteron system on a Tyan board with 16GB of RAM and Vista x64 Business, and a dual monitor.

The screen saver starts and runs fine except for 3 issues

A) When it comes out of screen saver, it seems to take a long time until I get past a wait state and can access the icons/programs on the tray or desktop - let's say about 8 to 12 seconds.

B) Related, Seems like sometimes it has re-arranged my tray icons, almost like there was a crash of the explorer/desktop program and it re-initiated

C) Whenever I go into the Windows Control Panel screen saver panel, which is accessing the Marine Settings panel, or I get into the Marine settings and then close it, when the settings panel closes, I get the following "App Crash"...every time. To be clear, it saves the settings changes, but it always triggers the crash and the message


3) Can you tell me if running the Non-Beta would avoid these issues?

See attached files and the crash text below -
>
> Problem signature:
> Problem Event Name: APPCRASH
> Application Name: MarineAquarium3.scr
> Application Version: 0.0.0.3
> Application Timestamp: 4a08a76d
> Fault Module Name: MarineAquarium3.scr
> Fault Module Version: 0.0.0.3
> Fault Module Timestamp: 4a08a76d
> Exception Code: c0000005
> Exception Offset: 000068f6
> OS Version: 6.0.6001.2.1.0.256.6
> Locale ID: 1033
> Additional Information 1: 0d7e
> Additional Information 2: a54b787cb67361c2346fdb00971f7f88
> Additional Information 3: 0d2f
> Additional Information 4: c69c8927e57ef37ea9984d0d4517f516
>


Also, can you tell me what is the difference between the 2.x Non-Beta and the 3.X Beta Version as to features/functionality?
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Old 06-02-2009, 01:23 PM   #2
feldon34
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In answer to your questions Marine Aquarium 3 has a totally new 3D coral artwork which is 3 screens wide. It is rebuilt from scratch. You can also add your own music files and playlists. However some features like control over the lights are not as good just yet. MA3 is in active development so new versions come out every month.

Going back to MA2.6, you will be reverting to the old background which is a 1024 x 768 bitmap. The aquarium will not span both monitors.

No idea on the other issues you are experiencing.
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Old 06-02-2009, 03:30 PM   #3
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Originally posted by sca:
The screen saver starts and runs fine except for 3 issues

A) When it comes out of screen saver, it seems to take a long time until I get past a wait state and can access the icons/programs on the tray or desktop - let's say about 8 to 12 seconds.

B) Related, Seems like sometimes it has re-arranged my tray icons, almost like there was a crash of the explorer/desktop program and it re-initiated
 
When MA3 comes out of screensaver mode, it first goes to "windowed" mode - that's the "reason" there is a delay. You may observe a "black window" appear.

Speculation about the icons: Screen resolution? If you do not have the display settings set to "Automatic", then the screen resolution may be changing, which might cause your screen to be rearranged?


Originally posted by sca:
C) Whenever I go into the Windows Control Panel screen saver panel, which is accessing the Marine Settings panel, or I get into the Marine settings and then close it, when the settings panel closes, I get the following "App Crash"...every time. To be clear, it saves the settings changes, but it always triggers the crash and the message  
I, also, don't have a clue - but this is a bug worth investigating. It's every time you exit "settings", and no other time? [For instance, does it happen when switching to/from windowed mode?]

Originally posted by sca:
3) Can you tell me if running the Non-Beta would avoid these issues?
 
It would normally be the case that the Beta is LESS likely to have issues (except for new features being introduced). In your case, probably the Non-Beta would not help. But it wouldn't hurt to try it and see.

You can just do the trial (and enter code TESTFISH).
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Old 06-02-2009, 04:54 PM   #4
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It's virtually impossible to diagnose this kind of thing unless it happens on my machine with the debugger running.

Vista Business 64 is a total unknown, but it's possible that MA2.6 would run OK. MA2.6 and MA3 have almost nothing in common, code-wise.
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Old 06-02-2009, 06:21 PM   #5
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Originally posted by Jim Sachs:
It's virtually impossible to diagnose this kind of thing unless it happens on my machine with the debugger running.

Vista Business 64 is a total unknown, but it's possible that MA2.6 would run OK. MA2.6 and MA3 have almost nothing in common, code-wise.  

So

1) the error code from the App Crash tells you nothing about the cause?? and.....

2) You are going to issue a final version of a program which causes an App Crash every time you open the Settings Panel??

Otherwise, it's the finest looking aquarium program I have seen - !!!!! Great Great work. I would just like to get in and out of the control panel without triggering an application crash......
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Old 06-02-2009, 07:01 PM   #6
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1. No.

2. MA3 is still Beta, and will be for a long time, but if crashing on a single isolated system was reason enough to stop production on a piece of software, there would be no software. What I might consider doing is putting Vista 64 Business on the Not Compatible list. I don't know anything about it, but just from the name it sounds like it might have some Draconian policies for accessing the Registry.

If anyone out there can duplicate this, please let me know.
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Old 06-02-2009, 07:37 PM   #7
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Originally posted by Jim Sachs:
1. No.

2. MA3 is still Beta, and will be for a long time, but if crashing on a single isolated system was reason enough to stop production on a piece of software, there would be no software. What I might consider doing is putting Vista 64 Business on the Not Compatible list. I don't know anything about it, but just from the name it sounds like it might have some Draconian policies for accessing the Registry.

If anyone out there can duplicate this, please let me know.  

Let me know if I can send oyu anything that would help you figure out what the cause is - this happens every time, so I can certainly repeat it - not sure seeing it happen relates any further useful info - kinda of wonder what the purpose of the App Crash message is if it does provide somewhere to start looking - would be nice if it conveyed useful info for the Developer -

Thanks for the reply - !
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Old 06-02-2009, 08:25 PM   #8
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Thanks for the report, and we'll keep an eye out for anything which might shed light on your problem.
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Old 06-02-2009, 08:28 PM   #9
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Did you post the name or brand of your Video Card and do you have the most recent video driver?
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Old 06-02-2009, 08:31 PM   #10
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Stray thoughts:

Is there any additional (useful) information in the error log?

SP2 probably won't fix it, but it's worth a shot.
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/935791#Method3
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Old 06-03-2009, 12:41 PM   #11
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Originally posted by Edgar:
Did you post the name or brand of your Video Card and do you have the most recent video driver?  
Hi, thanks so much for your help with this. I have a Sapphire (ati) PCI-E X1650 pro. The driver did indeed need to be updated which I did just now to the the March/2009 driver. Rebooted but did not cause any change.

I did check the "start in windowed" mode button, per one of the prior suggestions and that seems to have stopped the long re-draw process coming out of the screen saver
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Old 06-03-2009, 01:26 PM   #12
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I get the same sort of crash, but not everytime, when running the beta via an in-house compatibility layer app that "trampolines" the app's registry calls to a file.

I'd be willing to track down the problem call as the aclayer app has debugging facilities built into it.
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Old 06-03-2009, 02:06 PM   #13
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Originally posted by Dale:
Stray thoughts:

Is there any additional (useful) information in the error log?

SP2 probably won't fix it, but it's worth a shot.
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/935791#Method3  
I will try updating later - I can't reboot right now nor shut everything down for a major upgrade like service pack 2...

I am wondering, can I change the title of this thread, and if not, maybe I should re-post this - I originally combined two issues - what is the difference between Beta and Non-beta, and 2) the App Crash, but I see in the list of threads, you hardly see the main point of the thread now, which should be retitled "App Crash Accessing the Settings Panel".

Can the moderator do that?? so that we might get more people with the same issue....
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Old 06-03-2009, 02:52 PM   #14
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I've renamed the thread and rearranged your first post so it is clear what you are needing the most help with.
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Old 06-03-2009, 05:37 PM   #15
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Originally posted by feldon33:
I've renamed the thread and rearranged your first post so it is clear what you are needing the most help with.  
Thanks so much -

1) right now I am running the download/freeload. Can I pay for the Beta?? Should I pay for the non-beat and get a registration code to enter into the Beta??

2) Is there a thread to register on to get notification of beta update/upgrade releases as fixes are made?
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Old 06-03-2009, 06:19 PM   #16
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Originally posted by sca:
Thanks so much -

1) right now I am running the download/freeload. Can I pay for the Beta?? Should I pay for the non-beat and get a registration code to enter into the Beta??  
You can buy MA3 yes, at SereneScreen.com

Originally posted by sca:
2) Is there a thread to register on to get notification of beta update/upgrade releases as fixes are made?  
https://www.feldoncentral.com/forums...ription&t=4385
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Old 06-03-2009, 08:46 PM   #17
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sca - Don't buy it if it doesn't run properly on your machine. That's exactly why we let people try it for free.

The old MA2.6 program (the one you're calling non-Beta) is only $9.95. An MA2.6 Key will not work in MA3, but it's only $9.95 to upgrade, so the total cost is basically the same as just buying MA3 outright.
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Old 06-04-2009, 09:51 AM   #18
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Jim or Edgar, if you're interested, I found the problem here and was able to come up with a work around. I was able to get the beta to crash every time by going to settings->program settings and then OKing out (when running under the compatibility layer.)

Turns out that the compatibility layer enables its own unhandled SEH via a call to SetUnhandledExceptionFilter. When that option is turned off, the crashes stop occuring. The crashes occur in MS's CTF dll, btw, which is used for language switching via the language bar. I looked but I couldn't find a way to turn it off in Vista like you could in XP.

Hope that helps.
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Old 06-04-2009, 10:06 AM   #19
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Thanks for the info. I looked up Compatability Layer, but it's way beyond me.
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Old 06-04-2009, 10:57 AM   #20
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So can the Aquarium be run with Compatibility Layer turned off? I thought Marine Aquarium 3 worked relatively ok on Vista without resorting to any backwards compatibility modes?


Jim,

It's an attempt to allow XP programs which are not Vista-aware to run the 'old-fashioned way' but I have not heard that it runs particularly well. They are eliminating this half-baked 'compatibility layer' in Windows 7 and moving to a full Windows XP Virtual Machine. Literally Windows XP boots up inside a window and you can run your programs inside a 'real' XP environment which is insulated from Windows 7. It should run old programs much better.

Unfortunately, for reasons that no-one can figure out, Microsoft built Windows 7's virtual machine functionality in such a way that it will only work on premium AMD and Intel processors. All those folks who have bought the less expensive, but otherwise powerful Intel and AMD processors over the last few years will be out-of-luck. Strange since there are already excellent virtual machines that don't require these special processors.
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