Same with me.. It "looks" like it wants to start, gives me the splash screen then an error message.

I have just tested this and it runs fine on my rig, I am running a HP Pavilion Slimline 10 months old with on-board graphics chip and am running Windows 8, runs just as well as original, and, I too would like the "doctors" surgery, well done on your experimenting. Jim

jleslie, I'm sorry about that. But there's nothing I can do here beyond what I'm already doing to ensure everything is malware free on my end.

cjmdaddy and Ralph, I read up on multi-monitor support and I think I found out some of what I was doing wrong. The attached version has some changes for multi-monitor use that may fix the crashing. But I'm pretty sure I still don't have it all correct.

To all, thanks for the feedback. I do consider the room model and tank as part of the background as well. I'm willing to do any work that has no possibility of breaking the illusion Mr. Sachs has created. I'm adding stuff in stages to give those with less powerful pcs a chance to see at least some of it without completely bogging down their MA3 animations.

Attached is a new version that uses a cpu driven water surface with a fake reflection of the background room, which is represented at this time by a simple pic. I pulled in the back of the tank frame to show more of the room. This is the version that has the best chance to work on older and slower pcs, although it still requires some power in the cpu and a reasonable fill rate in the gpu. If all goes well it should look like the attached pic.

In following posts I'll attach some more high quality pics you can use as backgrounds. See the readme.txt file in the bkgnd folder for the easy steps to do this.

Here's a couple more backgrounds you can use with the above version of the app.

Here's another background you can use with the above version of the app.

OK. Now THAT looks cool! I have one suggestion though. There is too much water surface showing and it is angled too much. Decrease the angle so that only a half inch of water surface shows, instead of the one and a half inch that shows now. Anybody else agree?

You fixed the problem for me.. all of your new backgrounds now work spread across two monitors, or on a single one.:TU:

I'm back home for a couple of days, so I finally got a chance to download and run this.

flipper - You're bumping into all the problems I did when I explored having a background pic, ten years ago. At that time I decided to use a background wash mostly to save clock cycles. After a few years computers got faster, so that became a moot point. But the other problems remain - The inclusion of a giant hi-res bitmap for the background texture (greatly increasing the size of the program), the mismatch of the perspective between the tank and the background, and the necessity of showing the underside of the water surface, which is just never going to look real.

I'm still interested in seeing the bending of camera angles which made that first picture you posted so tantalizing. (And I'm still mystified as to how you are accomplishing any of this without the source code.)

The DirectX models (*.x files) and textures (*.dds) files arent that hard to tweak.

In mother Russia, children are hacking before they can walk. ;)

Yes, it's fixed for me also. The background is now spread nicely across both monitors....:TU: - But, I agree, I think there is too much water surface showing, and I don't like the degree of detail shown in the reflection. - In my opinion it's too distracting and looks unnatural.

The perspective between the tank and the background seems to work for me, across the two screens, but I think the type of background chosen needs to be carefully thought about if the focus of attention, is to remain with the aquarium and its contents.

All in all, it's a very clever idea, and very well executed.... But is it what MA3 really needs?
After a period of experimentation, it's something of a relief to return to a nice dark blue/green graded background. With nothing distracting from the intended underwater coral scene.

... Perhaps the answer, is to have a distant extended underwater coral background? ..... Or none at all?

i agree, too much water showing at the top, looks good ;)

Morgan - True, the existing DirectX models and textures aren't hard to tweak (and it's been done many times), but these are additional models, textures, and code to run them. Even with the source code, adding a new object is a major job. The C++ objects have to be created, instantiated, initialized, and released at the proper time or memory leaks will occur. The algorithm to 'run' the object (like the moving water surface) has to be called. The object has to be displayed at exactly the right instant within the critical Render() loop for each monitor.

My hat is off to Flipper for being able to accomplish all that.

Good point Jim. Mostly I was trying to be subtle about saying I'm in St. Petersburg Russia ;)

Neat! It's probably a good time to visit Europe, while everyone else is in London :)

While I was unable to sleep this AM ... amazing what you can solve:D My take on how flipper may have done this.

I think the door flipper found was in your settings panel where we can change the background. This call would be easy to find. He then changed the code to call his MA3Ex.dll that does at least 2 things.. a) confirm a registration key exists.. if not > exit (:)) b) insert loft.dxt3 in place of your background and run program.

But.. many of my early morning solution to problems turn out to be wrong..:D

There is no background picture or object in my code. It's just a smooth wash of colors.

I've been busy trying to get a perspectively correct mirrored background image onto the water surface while maintaining the original MA3 projection matrix or I would have responded earlier. Sorry about that.

The techniques used have been around for decades. MS uses them in their app shim and compatibility layer code, for instance. They're also used a lot in game mods and other types of malware.

In a nutshell, but a bit techy, MA3Ex.exe starts MA3.scr but suspended. It then adds MA3Ex.dll into MA3.scr's process address space, tweaks the process' starting point to call MA3Ex.dll's entry point instead, resumes MA3.scr's execution and then quits.

When MA3.scr starts running again it gives control to MA3Ex.dll, which then uses "api hook"ing to cause the creation of D3D devices to be rerouted to its code. That code allows the call to go through to D3D, and upon a successful creation, adds the device to its good devices list and, using "code hook"ing, causes several of the D3D devices methods to be rerouted to its code. Methods such as BeginScene, DrawPrimitive, SetTexture, SetTransform, etc. So at that point MA3Ex.dll essentially has as much control of MA3.scr's interfaces with D3D as it wants. The same technique could be used for other app->OS api interfaces as well.

It also uses a similar but different hooking technique to take control of the keyboard and mouse.

Regarding the different camera viewpoint I use in my own version of this, if you're willing to allow me to make it public, I'll start working on getting that code into this version. As it's proven to be very difficult to get a correct looking mirrored scene onto the water surface while mucking with two different fields of view (I think as you indicated above.)

Amazing (and horrifying).

Jim,

It's been 11 1/2 years. You've indicated that income from it is nearly minimal which discourages further effort. What is the likelihood that there will be another update to the Aquarium?

Your strength is as an artist and animator. What is the harm in seeing what someone else can do? I think there are programmers out there that respect the artistic integrity of what you are doing and would love to help.

And then I can split my $9 per hour with them.

One year you made what? $2m?

The Aquarium was the right product presented to the right audience at the right time. It could happen again.

Half that. Still great, and I'm not complaining. But the New Normal is $9 per hour since all the computer stores went out of business. Changes and additions to the product have made no difference at all. Advertising is the only thing that helps, but it's so expensive that it's only feasible if some other company picks up the tab.

My two cents.. In my opinion.. MA3 with its 3D panning and a reduced number of fish should have been the base. Any movement of corral, the addition of the feather dusters, interactive clams, Harvey the eel, the starfish, specialty fish, should have been part of the "creature pack".
But.. we are where we are. How to now incorporate a creature pack would be a major challenge as it would entail at least a number of "new" to make it attractive.
Barring a totally new approach to fish movement I think MA3 is as complete as it will ever be. I would speculate that a totally new SS (butterfly?) would be a better investment of time

Not to re-open old wounds, Jim. But I think you might be able to up you income to $10 or $12 per hour by releasing a new product called "Marine Aquarium Live Wallpaper."

I know you rejected this idea when some one created a modification to allow this several years ago. I, for one, would pay full price for it.

Bob Frank

Ralph - I agree. It would have to be something new, with a very different look to attract any attention. Anything fish-related would be ignored as old-hat.

Bob - Thanks for the suggestion, but I don't think I'll be doing that. However, as I mentioned somewhere else, the Mindspark advertising connection has improved sales enough so that I might be adding a couple of freebee critters.

My official position on this background-addition subject is that I don't see how it could ever be good enough to fool anyone into believng that it's real. As a scientist, I try to keep an open mind, but just the fact that the underside of the surface would show is enough to (almost) certainly doom it to failure. I have never seen an algorithm which could realistically duplicate all the reflections/refraction/perturbations to achieve this - not in a software product or a $100-million movie. I solved the problem 12 years ago by positioning the camera so that the problem area was not visible, and don't see any good reason to re-open the can of worms.

Jim, you are justifiably proud of the science and artistry of Marine Aquarium, and you and the simulation are honored and respected.

From what you have written (please correct me if I'm wrong), you are saying that Marine Aquarium is finished and you do not intend to make any changes.

Will you be angry if someone attempts to modify or add to Marine Aquarium?

Yes, I know that is not a polite question - but I think it's important.

This sounds very lovely, Jim! And although I would be very happy to recieve a few freebee's, how about spending slightly longer on doing even a few more and charge $5-10?

As you wrote that there wasn't much increase in sales when you added the feather duster or eel, perhaps charging a small fee for the additions would help?

hillover -

No, I'm not saying that there will be no more changes to the Aquarium. Just the opposite - I'm saying that due to the slight increase in sales brought on by Mindspark, I plan to add some more creatures soon.

Regarding anger at others modifying the program - I really wish I could say I have none, but my wife tells me I've started grinding my teeth at night.


Yodelking -

The amount of work necessary for a Creature Pack compared to a few freebee creatures is not slight. It's probably at least an order of magnitude.

That might be true, but it's also the difference between charging for it and giving it away.

Come on now everybody, if Jim wants to add new stuff for free then who are we to say he has to charge for it?

Sorry I misunderstood, and thanks for the clarifications.

Here's a possibly last update to the old tech previous version of the mod. Energy into the system now only occurs over the bubble column so it'll take a minute or two to propagate to the rest of the surface. If all goes well it should look like the attached pic. Several control keys (doc'd in the readme) have also been added to tweak the settings some and change the view as you see fit.

There's also a new 2048 room texture attached.

There's plenty more to come if you guys want it, including DirectX9 HLSL shader based versions for the water surface that give you pixel level rendering and AAA title quality. And more mods than I know where to begin listing.

But you're going to have to make your voices heard. I'm just here to freely share and have fun, not pick a fight. So far no one's told me to go away, publically or privately. In fact, privately, it's been just the opposite.

I think the idea has potential, but I also think that the water surface looks unreal and too distracting. In my opinion, the water surface would be better left out altogether.

glad to hear that there will be more updates to this. i have been using this for years and just now found the forums here. better late then never i guess!! :erm::rolleyes:

I guess this has been abandoned now? It was looking like it had loads of potential, the plain background is the only reason this isn't my full time screensaver.

No, it's not abandoned. I hope to return to it soon, after some family issues are resolved.

thank you flipper
 

Flipper - your work is amazing, thank you for breathing some life into this decade old program! Jim did some amazing work with this originally - maybe a fresh perspective was necessary to take it to the next level. All the best to you.

Flipper - THANK YOU! It has been quite awhile since I visited this forum. I have had the MA screen saver since the very beginning and I always come back to see if there are any updates. Your addition is fantastic. I can't get over how much more realistic it looks.
Jim - Thank you also for a great product and I look forward to anything new you see fit to add.

Remember to be good
Santa

MA is an amazing program that still holds me entranced to this day, however life seems to have planned other things for Jim and it seems extremely unlikely there will ever be any further major developments.

Flippers extension of MA is also a major achievement, however I think it gets its wow factor from providing a different perspective of the corals that adds to the illusion that it is solid 3D and not particularly from the background that I actually find a bit distracting. I wonder what it would look like with a blurry distant static view of other corals as a background, like a "tacky" wallpaper background on a real aquarium. It's a shame this wasn't able to be taken further as an experiment to see what was possible as an extension to an already existing program.

I'm not a programmer, but it seems like Flippers extension are like plugins to a main program that add functionality but can not do anything without that original program at its core. Consequently I don't understand the reluctance to encouraging those sort of extensions since they have the potential to garner additional or renewed interest in MA. Even if the extensions were free, they would be useless without purchasing MA, so the extensions could encourage more sales of MA. It should be understood that the extensions are not guaranteed to work in all situations but one can fall back to the already excellent MA and not lose anything, only potentially gain additional functionality.

Anyway, that's my amateur perspective as simply a member of the public who loves MA and would like to see some extensions too.